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CO-BROKERING:

Jan 24, 2022 at 03:16 PM CST
+ 12

Is anyone "co-brokering" loads (NOT double brokering) and if so, how is it working out?

Replied on Tue, Jan 25, 2022 at 10:11 AM CST

What is the difference? If someone has a load, you take it and move it, then it is double brokered! Two people (companies) making money off of one load is double brokering. No grey area there.

Replied on Tue, Jan 25, 2022 at 11:50 AM CST

Working out for WHO is the question??

Replied on Tue, Jan 25, 2022 at 12:35 PM CST
+ 1

Co-brokering and double brokering are NOT the same.

Double brokering when when you tell a broker that you are a carrier and can take their load when you are actually a broker yourself and find a truck to move the load that YOU agreed to do yourself.

Co-brokering is when Broker A has the loads and Broker B has the capacity of the trucks needed to move the loads. Both brokers sign contracts stating that Broker B will not steal A's customers and Broker A will not steal B's carriers and they split the profit on whatever the terms on the contract are.

I would be interested in co-brokering but would never agree to double brokering, even though I've recently gotten SEVERAL calls from quite a few "big name" brokers flat out asking if I will double broker.

Replied on Tue, Jan 25, 2022 at 01:24 PM CST
Quote: "What is the difference? If someone has a load, you take it and move it, then it is double brokered! Two people (companies) making money off of one load is double brokering. No grey area there."

Simply put it is highly illegal to double broker loads period
Replied on Tue, Jan 25, 2022 at 03:17 PM CST
Quote: "Simply put it is highly illegal to double broker loads period"

Right! So let's just call it "co brokering" and take a little more off the top before the carrier, with all the expenses gets the crumbs that are left! Where is the government to step in on this BS?

Replied on Tue, Jan 25, 2022 at 09:17 PM CST
I have worked with a couple brokers that could load me from point a to point b. Instead of ripping me off they then told me who could load me where I wanted to go. I'm happy to work with these trustworthy people. Co brokering is just an excuse to screw the truck. Very short sighted. Art
Replied on Tue, Jan 25, 2022 at 09:17 PM CST
+ 1
That’s not co brokering my family been in this industry dating back to 1865 and since 1907 carrier are the critical backbone of the industry who perform all the hard work and take all the risk of moving freight and getting it to it destinations on time. They are the one who should be paid first then every body else. Not the other way around. Sorry to all brokers who feel that should not the case. #TeamCarrier strong
Replied on Wed, Jan 26, 2022 at 09:21 AM CST
+ 1
Quote: "Co-brokering and double brokering are NOT the same. Double brokering when when you tell a broker that you are a carrier and can take their load when you are actually a broker yourself and find a truck to move the load that YOU agreed to do yourself. Co-brokering is when Broker A has the loads and Broker B has the capacity of the trucks needed to move the loads. Both brokers sign contracts stating that Broker B will not steal A's customers and Broker A will not steal B's carriers and they split the profit on whatever the terms on the contract are. I would be interested in co-brokering but would never agree to double brokering, even though I've recently gotten SEVERAL calls from quite a few "big name" brokers flat out asking if I will double broker. "

Exactly! Some wont see it this way.

Replied on Wed, Jan 26, 2022 at 09:22 AM CST
Quote: "Right! So let's just call it "co brokering" and take a little more off the top before the carrier, with all the expenses gets the crumbs that are left! Where is the government to step in on this BS?"

The main difference between co-brokering and double brokering was stated above, but the legal difference is a double broker doesn't allow for the protection of a broker bond, which makes the action of brokering said load illegal. They also have crap insurance in my experience (one would only pay via court order). Co Brokering is used in limited situations over on my side of the fence but it can be very handy when we all have a piece of the puzzle to get a trip for a truck.

The biggest issue for me is that if a carrier takes a load from me, then double brokers it to another carrier (or broker) then my bond and insurance automatically steps away because it is illegaly brokered. So now I am at a huge exposure. Our contract is very specific about non payment for unauthorized rebrokering of loads. If you suspect the load you received from a broker was illegaly re brokered then I highly suggest you take a quickpay and put them on a DNU list. You still as the delivering carrier have a right to collect freight, but the hassle will be ridiculous. The last one I went through, I figured out the delivering carrier, had him confirm that he did get paid from the bad actor broker and was satisfied, and then I broke the news to the bad actor and filed a Carrier 411 report. We see a ton of these attempted re brokers based in the Glendale, CA area, it's some bizarre scheme that has been going on for quite a while, the governement has apparently not done anything about it.

My experience is that this is very rare in bulk, if it's "re brokered" it's usually the carrier having his neighbor or buddy run it and paying him for it, which is still technically illegal but a way more above board way of going about it and not nearly the disaster that I've seen in the van/reefer world.

Stay warm out there!

Replied on Wed, Jan 26, 2022 at 09:22 AM CST
Quote: "Simply put it is highly illegal to double broker loads period"

While I agree, there doesn't seem to be any enforcement and there is no way to report violations to FMCSA that I'm aware of. It is truley like the wild west, you can add 'dispatch services' on the list as well.

Replied on Wed, Jan 26, 2022 at 11:29 AM CST
Quote: "While I agree, there doesn't seem to be any enforcement and there is no way to report violations to FMCSA that I'm aware of. It is truley like the wild west, you can add 'dispatch services' on the list as well."

My understanding is it is all about who is paying who (where does the money flow) -

if I own a truck and pay a dispatch service for booking loads for me, but all of the shippers/brokers pay my directly, then that is within the rules of the law.

If a broker pays another broker who also has all the legal credentials to be a broker (bond, ins, auhtority) then that is legal.

If a broker pays a carrier, who then pays another carrier for actually moving the shipment, then that is illegal.

If a broker pays a carrier, who pays a broker (legally setup) who pays a carrier that actually moves the shipment that is illegal because the carrier in the middle doesn't have a broker authority etc.

There actually is a reporting mechanism through the FMCSA - if you can believe this, I have filed a couple reports over the years and have never even received an email saying they've got the report, much less any sort of inquiry for more details etc. They're absolutely worthless - all those comapnies are still in business with active authorities, and I even provided full documentation to prove my case - crickets.

Replied on Wed, Jan 26, 2022 at 01:29 PM CST
Quote: "My understanding is it is all about who is paying who (where does the money flow) - if I own a truck and pay a dispatch service for booking loads for me, but all of the shippers/brokers pay my directly, then that is within the rules of the law. If a broker pays another broker who also has all the legal credentials to be a broker (bond, ins, auhtority) then that is legal. If a broker pays a carrier, who then pays another carrier for actually moving the shipment, then that is illegal. If a broker pays a carrier, who pays a broker (legally setup) who pays a carrier that actually moves the shipment that is illegal because the carrier in the middle doesn't have a broker authority etc. There actually is a reporting mechanism through the FMCSA - if you can believe this, I have filed a couple reports over the years and have never even received an email saying they've got the report, much less any sort of inquiry for more details etc. They're absolutely worthless - all those comapnies are still in business with active authorities, and I even provided full documentation to prove my case - crickets. "

I don't doubt this in the slightest. They say it's illegal but then when it is reported, nothing is done. Meanwhile, the carrier our here trying to provide for his/her family gets a notch on their inspection due to tire pressure being lower than they like.

I see how this is from different aspects of the industry but if the carriers are being held to s certain standard to maintain their abilities, I feel EVERYONE should be under some standard besides just filing, paying, and being listed on the website.

Replied on Thu, Jan 27, 2022 at 10:22 AM CST
Quote: "My understanding is it is all about who is paying who (where does the money flow) - if I own a truck and pay a dispatch service for booking loads for me, but all of the shippers/brokers pay my directly, then that is within the rules of the law. If a broker pays another broker who also has all the legal credentials to be a broker (bond, ins, auhtority) then that is legal. If a broker pays a carrier, who then pays another carrier for actually moving the shipment, then that is illegal. If a broker pays a carrier, who pays a broker (legally setup) who pays a carrier that actually moves the shipment that is illegal because the carrier in the middle doesn't have a broker authority etc. There actually is a reporting mechanism through the FMCSA - if you can believe this, I have filed a couple reports over the years and have never even received an email saying they've got the report, much less any sort of inquiry for more details etc. They're absolutely worthless - all those comapnies are still in business with active authorities, and I even provided full documentation to prove my case - crickets. "

If a broker has decent rates and is vigilent about paying on time, then he/she should need no "co-brokering". If I work with a broker, I want it to be the broker who has the direct affiliation with the shipper, not someone who got the load from a guy who might have seen the shipper's name in the phone book.

Let's just say that I think it is wrong for 2 or more companies to take a portion off the top before it gets to the truck owner. I pulled refer for a while in the 90's and had a load that went through 4 brokers to get to the original broker, who was someone that we worked with on a regular basis and 40 miles from our shop. This stuff should not be happening!

Replied on Fri, Jan 28, 2022 at 10:48 AM CST
Quote: "If a broker has decent rates and is vigilent about paying on time, then he/she should need no "co-brokering". If I work with a broker, I want it to be the broker who has the direct affiliation with the shipper, not someone who got the load from a guy who might have seen the shipper's name in the phone book. Let's just say that I think it is wrong for 2 or more companies to take a portion off the top before it gets to the truck owner. I pulled refer for a while in the 90's and had a load that went through 4 brokers to get to the original broker, who was someone that we worked with on a regular basis and 40 miles from our shop. This stuff should not be happening!"

I don't disagree with you Ed, but there are situations where the carriers don't want to go through the hassle of a carrier setup or whatever reason to work with one broker over the other. I won't name names but one of the only other brokers that I work with has trucks that run exclusively with them. It works well for everyone in that situation, and everyone knows what is going on, it's more or less for convenience of using my load to move their truck to grab one of their loads. A lot of times it's just about the relationship as well (good or bad). I couldn't tell you how many times I've heard "I like so-and-so's load but I can't stand him, if you want to deal with him I'll run it through you." Part of being a Broker is dealing with people to make a truck's life as simple as possible, especially guys that run exclusive or semi-exclusive for us. Sometimes there's more to it than guys trying to screw a buck from the truck.